tashlinfan44
2019-09-30T16:15:56Z
I’ve been going through the HD Popeyes on Boomerang, and I’m having a hard time trying to find out which cartoons have original titles, or fake titles. Does anyone have a list of cartoons that were restored with original titles and which weren’t?
Jason Todd
2019-10-01T07:28:21Z
As presented on the Fleischer DVD sets, the cartoons that appear with recreated--not restored--title sequences are as follows:

Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1, 1933-1938
• Dizzy Divers (1935)
• You Gotta Be a Football Hero (1935)
• King of the Mardi Gras (1935)
• Adventures of Popeye (1935)
• The Spinach Overture (1935)
• Vim, Vigor and Vitaliky (1936)
• Hold the Wire (1936)
• The Spinach Roadster (1936)
• Fowl Play (1936)
• I'm in the Army Now (1937)
• The Paneless Window Washer (1937)
• The Organ Grinder's Swing (1937)
• Let's Celebrake (1938)
• Learn Polikeness (1938)
• The House Builder-Upper (1937)
• Big Chief Ugh-a-mug Ugh (1938)
Popeye the Sailor: Volume 2, 1938-1940
• Customers Wanted (1939)
• Hello, How Am I? (1939)
Popeye the Sailor: Volume 3, 1941-1943
• Scrap the Japs (1942)
• Spinach fer Britain (1943)
• Too Weak to Work (1943)
• The Hungry Goat (1943)
• Wood-Peckin' (1943)
• Cartoons Ain't Human (1943).

The case of the black-and-white Famous cartoons are more difficult to pinpoint their title card presentation than the handful of Fleischer shorts listed above, because the fakery involved with some of their respective intros is quite noticeable, but you can tell which early Famous cartoons had their titles recreated because, when the Popeye logo dissolves into the credit screen, the windowboxed edges of the screen change via digital crossfade.

All other Popeye cartoons are presented with their titles properly restored.
Mesterius
2019-10-01T10:45:15Z
Jason: Um, what about Popeye's debut cartoon, 1933's "Popeye The Sailor "? I recently rewatched it on DVD, and something which really stood out was the jarring transition between the "A Paramount Picture" logo and the "Popeye the Sailor" title card which followed. It feels obvious that the original Paramount logo is missing here, and the logo that we see has been edited in from elsewhere. Compare also with this old AAP print , and you'll see that the Popeye the Sailor title card starts at exactly the same spot as on the DVD version.
tashlinfan44
2019-10-01T13:08:17Z
Originally Posted by: Jason Todd 

As presented on the Fleischer DVD sets, the cartoons that appear with recreated--not restored--title sequences are as follows:

Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1, 1933-1938
• Dizzy Divers (1935)
• You Gotta Be a Football Hero (1935)
• King of the Mardi Gras (1935)
• Adventures of Popeye (1935)
• The Spinach Overture (1935)
• Vim, Vigor and Vitaliky (1936)
• Hold the Wire (1936)
• The Spinach Roadster (1936)
• Fowl Play (1936)
• I'm in the Army Now (1937)
• The Paneless Window Washer (1937)
• The Organ Grinder's Swing (1937)
• Let's Celebrake (1938)
• Learn Polikeness (1938)
• The House Builder-Upper (1937)
• Big Chief Ugh-a-mug Ugh (1938)
Popeye the Sailor: Volume 2, 1938-1940
• Customers Wanted (1939)
• Hello, How Am I? (1939)
Popeye the Sailor: Volume 3, 1941-1943
• Scrap the Japs (1942)
• Spinach fer Britain (1943)
• Too Weak to Work (1943)
• The Hungry Goat (1943)
• Wood-Peckin' (1943)
• Cartoons Ain't Human (1943).

The case of the black-and-white Famous cartoons are more difficult to pinpoint their title card presentation than the handful of Fleischer shorts listed above, because the fakery involved with some of their respective intros is quite noticeable, but you can tell which early Famous cartoons had their titles recreated because, when the Popeye logo dissolves into the credit screen, the windowboxed edges of the screen change via digital crossfade.

All other Popeye cartoons are presented with their titles properly restored.



Paramount sent Korea their only original title print of “Protek the Weakerist,” hence why it’s recreated on the Popeye Show and on the DVD set.

I think “Little Swee’Pea,” “A Date to Skate” and “Sock a bye Baby” are recreated too.

Did you make this list up with using your own knowledge?
Jason Todd
2019-10-01T18:24:13Z
Originally Posted by: Mesterius 

Jason: Um, what about Popeye's debut cartoon, 1933's "Popeye The Sailor "? I recently rewatched it on DVD, and something which really stood out was the jarring transition between the "A Paramount Picture" logo and the "Popeye the Sailor" title card which followed. It feels obvious that the original Paramount logo is missing here, and the logo that we see has been edited in from elsewhere. Compare also with this old AAP print , and you'll see that the Popeye the Sailor title card starts at exactly the same spot as on the DVD version.



I didn't realize that Popeye's first entry had its titles recreated. I just assumed that the jump cut between the Paramount logo and the Betty Boop/Popeye title card was a result of the print used for that specific cartoon, not a faked title recreation.
Jason Todd
2019-10-01T18:42:09Z
Originally Posted by: tashlinfan44 

Paramount sent Korea their only original title print of “Protek the Weakerist,” hence why it’s recreated on the Popeye Show and on the DVD set.

I think “Little Swee’Pea,” “A Date to Skate” and “Sock a bye Baby” are recreated too.

Did you make this list up with using your own knowledge?



In going through each cartoon chronologically, I concluded that the entries that are presented with their proper original titles could be pinpointed because there's noticeable dirt, film scratches and occasional shakiness throughout each sequence. The recreated titles, for the most part, seem to lack such authenticities. In the case of the Volume 1 shorts, and even a handful of those on Volume 2, you can tell which ones were faked.

The Volume 2 shorts I mentioned are listed because of the incorrect, A.A.P. Popeye title card in between the Paramount logo and the credit sequence. But, now that I think about it, the jump cut in between the logo and Popeye title card in It's the Natural Thing to Do might have been a result of inaccurate title recreation as well...
Gnik_LJN
2019-10-01T18:56:45Z
DVD's "Goonland" and "A Date to Skate" that aren't on the list have the '34 Paramount logo jump cut to the '34 Popeye title card, similar to "Customer Wanted" with the '34 Paramount logo jump cut to the AAP Popeye title card, so the criteria of "recreated" isn't quite clear. By the way, someone made this on Youtube... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yChNiQDrcVs 
Zachary
2019-10-01T19:04:50Z
http://mfoxweb-001-site2...3&t=9646&p=96863 

It doesn't note which ones have the original end titles. I had started work on accurately cataloging all this on all three volumes some time ago but never got it finished; might as well get back to it though.

Will note a few things for now:

Popeye the Sailor has the opening and end logos from Blow Me Down! tacked on. Curiously, as presented here, the end title is less cropped and hasn't had the original cue marks "restored" out. What's apparently the original end title can be seen on Let's Sing with Popeye.

Sock-a-Bye Baby has the original titles, but it looks like someone gaffed in editing the original end title on to the A.A.P. master, resulting in most of the inkwell iris-out still being left out. (The end title is not identical to the one on Let's You and Him Fight.) Of course, if they had done these cartoons right to begin with and used that far superior nitrate material for more than just reinstating the titles, such editing wouldn't have been so necessary.

Let's You and Him Fight's Can You Take It?'s titles are original but WB replaced most frames in the opening after a point with loops of a few frames. Either to patch over deterioration, or the restoration tech wanted to take the easy way out.

Protek the Weakerist is actually one of the handful of cartoons to use a quality element instead of the A.A.P. master for the body of the cartoon, and the end titles appear original but have been DVNR'd to all oblivion. Guess deterioration got to the opening titles. I actually own a 16mm print with the original titles, presumably a sibling to the one sent to Korea. They're out there. A PD producer apparently got a hold of one as well many years ago and used it to recreate the titles on their VHS release of Popeye cartoons (see, for instance, the low-res copy of Blow Me Down! that was uploaded to archive.org years ago and reuploaded elsewhere since).

Little Swee'Pea is the real deal as well.
Zachary
2019-10-02T01:45:01Z
Oops, had to correct myself: Can You Take It? is the one with the frame-looping that I noted above, not Let's You and Him Fight. Been a while and had them mixed up...
tashlinfan44
2019-10-02T13:06:27Z
Originally Posted by: Zachary 

Oops, had to correct myself: Can You Take It? is the one with the frame-looping that I noted above, not Let's You and Him Fight. Been a while and had them mixed up...



I recall hearing somewhere else saying that there were more nitrate prints on that 1st set that had frame looping...I've never noticed it until now, but I'm wondering....are there any other prints on that DVD that had frame looping on the intro?

Also, for "Sock, A Bye Baby," are you saying that they took the original titles from the nitrate 35mm print in Paramount's holdings, but they used the a.a.p print at the end, and then cut to the inkwell closing from another cartoon? (I don't know which cartoon, but I'm assuming "Blow Me Down!" because that's where they got the Paramount logo from on "Popeye the Sailor." If any cartoon was missing their Paramount opening or closing, then I'm assuming they took the logos from "Blow Me Down!")
Pasko
2019-10-03T01:58:03Z
The closing scene is from the a.a.p. print, the titles are original, so it's like watching the real thing with a few seconds of frames skipping ahead.

Zachary, how do you know that Sock has its original closing title? From what I see it's completely identical to 'Fight, so I assume the closing was damaged and they replaced it with 'Fight's.

For "Protek the Weakerist" they probably just got lazy. Off the top of my head, "Ghosks Is The Bunk" is another one of the rare cartoons whose body was restored from original materials.
tashlinfan44
2019-10-03T12:03:37Z
Originally Posted by: Pasko 

The closing scene is from the a.a.p. print, the titles are original, so it's like watching the real thing with a few seconds of frames skipping ahead.

Zachary, how do you know that Sock has its original closing title? From what I see it's completely identical to 'Fight, so I assume the closing was damaged and they replaced it with 'Fight's.

For "Protek the Weakerist" they probably just got lazy. Off the top of my head, "Ghosks Is The Bunk" is another one of the rare cartoons whose body was restored from original materials.



Off the top of my head, “Learn Polikeness” is another cartoon that used a quality element. I was able to only find those 3 cartoons as cartoons that didn’t use a.a.p elements for the body of the actual cartoon.
Mark The Shark
2019-10-31T01:15:51Z
Originally Posted by: Pasko 

The closing scene is from the a.a.p. print, the titles are original, so it's like watching the real thing with a few seconds of frames skipping ahead.

Zachary, how do you know that Sock has its original closing title? From what I see it's completely identical to 'Fight, so I assume the closing was damaged and they replaced it with 'Fight's.

For "Protek the Weakerist" they probably just got lazy. Off the top of my head, "Ghosks Is The Bunk" is another one of the rare cartoons whose body was restored from original materials.



Not only did the redrawn version of "Proteck The Weakerist" have the Paramount logo, as late as 1987 WPWR-TV in Chicago ran a black and white print with Paramount logos. It was the only one of the black and whites to have Paramount's logos. Oddly, I don't remember ever having seen it that way when WFLD-TV ran the cartoons (1974-87). WPWR got Popeye in the fall of 1987 and initially aired a small selection of black and white shorts, soon replacing them with the redrawn versions as the station received them.

The logo had the "stereoptic" line.
Bobby Bickert
2023-01-17T19:35:34Z
Originally Posted by: Jason Todd 

As presented on the Fleischer DVD sets, the cartoons that appear with recreated--not restored--title sequences are as follows:

Popeye the Sailor: Volume 1, 1933-1938
• Dizzy Divers (1935)
• You Gotta Be a Football Hero (1935)
• King of the Mardi Gras (1935)
• Adventures of Popeye (1935)
• The Spinach Overture (1935)
• Vim, Vigor and Vitaliky (1936)
• Hold the Wire (1936)
• The Spinach Roadster (1936)
• Fowl Play (1936)
• I'm in the Army Now (1937)
• The Paneless Window Washer (1937)
• The Organ Grinder's Swing (1937)
• Let's Celebrake (1938)
• Learn Polikeness (1938)
• The House Builder-Upper (1937)
• Big Chief Ugh-a-mug Ugh (1938)
Popeye the Sailor: Volume 2, 1938-1940
• Customers Wanted (1939)
• Hello, How Am I? (1939)
Popeye the Sailor: Volume 3, 1941-1943
• Scrap the Japs (1942)
• Spinach fer Britain (1943)
• Too Weak to Work (1943)
• The Hungry Goat (1943)
• Wood-Peckin' (1943)
• Cartoons Ain't Human (1943).

The case of the black-and-white Famous cartoons are more difficult to pinpoint their title card presentation than the handful of Fleischer shorts listed above, because the fakery involved with some of their respective intros is quite noticeable, but you can tell which early Famous cartoons had their titles recreated because, when the Popeye logo dissolves into the credit screen, the windowboxed edges of the screen change via digital crossfade.

All other Popeye cartoons are presented with their titles properly restored.



"I Wanna Be A Life Guard" should have the "Patent Pending" Paramount logo.

"I Never Changes My Altitude" should have the Stereoptical Process Paramount logo.

"Protek the Weakerist" should have the Stereoptical Process Paramount logo

"Bulldozing the Bull" has recreated titles. The aap prints cut off too much of the opening titles, not cutting from the aap logo to the titles until just before the titles fade and the ship doors open. The DVD version actually shortens the opening titles and cuts off part of the opening title music to compensate.

"The Mighty Navy" and "Nix on Hypnotricks" have recreated titles. The Popeye headshot should have a "sunburst" behind it, not the "spotlight" background from the 1942 releases.
Bobby Bickert
2023-01-17T19:57:22Z
Originally Posted by: Gnik_LJN 

DVD's "Goonland" and "A Date to Skate" that aren't on the list have the '34 Paramount logo jump cut to the '34 Popeye title card, similar to "Customer Wanted" with the '34 Paramount logo jump cut to the AAP Popeye title card, so the criteria of "recreated" isn't quite clear.



A print of "Goonland" with original titles has aired on MeTV and Turner Classic Movies. The aap prints of "Goonland" cut to the aap end title before the iris-out closes completely. But the iris-out closes completely in the print that has aired on MeTV on Turner Classic Movies. (Plus the opening dissolves from the Paramount logo to the opening titles instead of jumpcutting.)

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