Got more time on my hands now, here is a few more I missed

DAY AT THE PARK=KEEP OFF THE GRASS (1927)

Unidentified Fable retitles:
GAME HUNTER=Farmer Alfalfa hunting title, AFRICAN HUNTSMEN?
DESERT EXPLORER=Red Hot Sands?

I might have more UN-ID'd retitles in the future, but this is what I have for now. Seems Commonwealth's sound package had at least 100 of the 310+ Fables they repackaged, of the roughly 430 produced

Thank you again!

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Looking through copyrights again, and found it!

MONEY MAD=FROM RAGS TO RICHES AND BACK AGAIN (1924)

Amazing. Thank you, Strumm.

Strumm also pointed out to me an interesting fact that I overlooked so far: Most of the early Sound Fables 1929 were recycling products. They were apparently produced simply by grabbing an old Fable cartoon from a couple of years ago and adding a music track.
The 1928 sound experiments DINNER TIME and STAGE STRUCK appear to be original productions (although DINNER TIME is said to re-use some animation from the 1925 short HUNGRY HOUNDS, which I haven't watched). Starting in April 1929, sound cartoons were released (on a bi-weekly base) together with weekly silent Fables (until silent-only Fables were discontinued early in September that year).
The first one of these, PRESTO CHANGO (Apr 14, 1929), appears to be the same cartoons as THE MAGICIAN (Mar 20, 1927), judging from a review for this cartoon in Motion Picture News (MPN; Mar 18, 1927 issue). The same appears to be true for the following soundies:
SKATING HOUNDS (Apr 28): sound reissue of CRACKED ICE (Feb 17, 1927, confirmed by review in MPN, Feb 25, 1927).
[Note that the Commonwealth short commonly seen named CRACKED ICE  is actually ON THE ICE, a different Fable, as pointed out in the comments.]
FAITHFUL PUP (May 12): sound reissue of A DOG'S DAY (June 5, 1927; MPN June 17, 1927 but hard to tell from the review...).
CUSTARD PIES (May 26: sound reissue of THE PIE MAN (Mar 22, 1925; confirmed by copyright synopsis at Library of Congress).
WOOD CHOPPERS (June 9): sound reissue of LUMBER JACKS (Nov 30, 1924; copyright synopsis confirms).
CONCENTRATE (June 23): sound reissue of HOLD THAT THOUGHT (Jan 25, 1925; mentioned above).
THE JAIL BREAKERS (July 7): if this is a sound reissue, none of us could identify the template yet.
HOUSE CLEANING TIME (July 21): sound reissue of CLEAN UP WEEK (Mar 1, 1925, copyright synopsis confirms)
BUG HOUSE COLLEGE DAYS (Aug 4): sound reissue of BUGVILLE FIELD DAY (July 26, 1925; copyright synopsis)
A STONE AGE ROMANCE (Aug 18): sound reissue of WHEN MEN WERE MEN (July 12, 1925; copyright synopsis)
THE BIG SCARE (Sep 1): possibly sound reissue of THE END OF THE WORLD (June 7, 1925; no copyright synopsis or contemporary review found)
With Paul Terry gone (his last credit is on THE BIG SCARE) and John Foster taking over production, the development of original sound cartoons at Van Beuren's started up in a serious fashion. Taken together, it seems that whoever was in charge of production during spring/summer 1929, and that was by all accounts Terry, did not take sound on cartoons seriously and treated it as a transient fade. For Amadee Van Beuren, the new studio owner (since end of 1928), this fact would seem motivation enough to get Terry fired, regardless of his past merits. On the other hand when Terry, together with Frank Moser, founded Terrytoons, sound was embraced from the beginning, even spoken text and songs (which was missing at Van Beuren's for another couple of months).
Also a question (hoping for a comment from Tommy): Are the sound reissues really just that (i.e. a soundtrack attached to a silent cartoon) or are they rather remakes (with reanimated scenes, improved layouts or backgrounds, changes in the plot, etc.)? I am asking because the silent originals I have never seen and largely seem to be elusive. To me, at least. The only exception is HOLD THAT THOUGHT, recently posted as a Commonwealth reissue  named CONCENTRATE by Tommy. The picture element of that short is identical with that of the 1929 CONCENTRATE, frame by frame. I was speculating above, maybe too implicitly, that the Commonwealth short may actually be derived from a 1929 silent version of CONCENTRATE (since Pathé regularly released their Æsop's Sound Fables both as sound and silent versions way into 1930), rather than the 1925 HOLD THAT THOUGHT. Therefore, if the 1929 soundies were remakes rather than reissues, there should be differences.
EDIT: I was able to answer that question myself: After examining WHEN MEN WERE MEN and A STONE AGE ROMANCE side-by-side, the visual elements are identical. The Sound Fables in question are likely all reissues, rather than remakes.

JAIL BREAKERS is BIGGER AND BETTER JAILS.

I did a little more research into the sound Fables, pre JUNGLE FOOL, along with talking to kazblox a little, and here's what I've determined

1928 Sound Fables: These Fables are completely original, not reusing any footage from earlier Fables. DINNERTIME is too consistent with Foster's other 1928 Fables to have any footage lifted from a 1925 Fable. Beyond this, the copyright for HOUNDS has some action not present in DINNERTIME (in HUNGRY HOUNDS, we do see a small dog take some meat but puts it back at first, but he's supposed to spit in the Farmer's hands), and also enough footage not lifted into the later Fable (there's a whole section of the Farmer delivering meat while dogs chase his wagon). I also ran about the copyright to A DOG'S PARADISE, which also uses the same "dog raid a butcher's shop" story that HUNGRY HOUNDS and DINNERTIME have, so we know this isn't a trope reserved to just those two shorts (and Henry Bailey would do THE UNDERDOG the next year, which also has the same trope). STAGE STRUCK is also original, and even seems to try doing things with sound (there are musical pieces, and Farmer Al plays a banjo solo from what I've read; never seen the cartoon). I hope to see it someday

1929 Fables: Not a single Fable in 1929 is completely original. I wouldn't put it past Terry to of possibly added small shots where music is made, but that's it. If you can tell animator style well enough, you'll be able to see they don't look like 1929 Fables and definitely like the year they originally came from. I guess after STAGE STRUCK it was too much to do two releases a week, one silent and sound, or even make proper sound cartoons. It does seems the people who owned the master materials couldn't give a darn if they were sound and silent, and thus some of these reissued Fables ended up in both packages (I know DINNERTIME, THE MAGICIAN, CONCENTRATE, and BUGVILLE FIELD DAY did). I say THE MAGICIAN because my own documentation from print sales suggests unlike CONCENTRATE, it used its original 1927 title instead of PRESTO CHANGEO.

Also, about the Commonwealth CRACKED ICE being ON THE ICE from 1924, this seems to be the only time a silent Commonwealth got retitled! I once saw at Cartoon Carnival a silent Commonwealth of 1928's ON THE ICE, and it seems very likely the retitle was intentional to make sure the two were listed as different cartoons easily; its the only title that was used on two separate Fables, something that did NOT happen unless title cards were spliced on to different prints. Hope this clears things up

One thing I still don't understand is if BIG GAME (1931) is a real Aesop's Sound Fable or not.

Bumping this since it may be of interest to others that I have located a very rare print of the cartoon in question. Seeing it is a question for another time. At the very least, the existence of the print confirms this cartoon being 100% real

"The Iron Man"? Mr. Lee has got some explaining to do!

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"The Iron Man"? Mr. Lee has got some explaining to do!

In fact, The Iron Man movie has recently been found, and you can watch it for free on Youtube.

In fact, The Iron Man movie has recently been found

This is incredibly misleading for the fact this, like just about all Van Beuren cartoons, has never been lost, available in 16mm since the shorts were first made, issued on DVD more than once. Heck, I have it on 16mm too. Be careful with phrasing something as “lost”; it should only be used if it doesn’t exist entirely

In fact, The Iron Man movie has recently been found

This is incredibly misleading for the fact this, like just about all Van Beuren cartoons, has never been lost, available in 16mm since the shorts were first made, issued on DVD more than once. Heck, I have it on 16mm too. Be careful with phrasing something as “lost”; it should only be used if it doesn’t exist entirely

Excuse me, I misspoke.

I just meant that the cartoon was released on YouTube very recently (in 2020) but I wasn't talking about the film itself.

In any case, this film remains memorable as it was the last cartoon centered on the Farmer Alfalfa produced by Van Beuren just before Paul Terry took over the rights to the character.

Does anyone know what happened to the cartoons The Mill Pond and Tuning In, both released in 1929?

It looks like they've been removed from YouTube for some unknown reason.

Does anyone know what happened to the cartoons The Mill Pond and Tuning In, both released in 1929?

It looks like they've been removed from YouTube for some unknown reason.

Nobody can access these videos any more, because Tommy Stathes has privatized the films and sent copyright warnings to everyone else who has published them, in order to force them to remove their videos.

Unfortunately, it's the hard law of business: as soon as someone has the opportunity to capitalize on old cartoons, he'll do anything to eliminate his competitors, even if it means using dishonest methods like Mr. Sthates does. I myself fell victim to his shenanigans when he had my YouTube channel removed because I'd posted Dinky Doodle cartoons that were supposed to be in the public domain.

However, there are people who think differently, and I'd advise you to contact the Farmer Al Falfa YouTube channel. They're real specialists, and they explained to me very well why certain public domain cartoons were removed, so maybe they'll agree to publish these two cartoons.

What are you even talking about? The person who had TUNING IN uploaded just removed it on their own. Both cartoons have been circulating from the Garage Sale transfers for a long time, so if anyone uploaded them again, it'd be alright. I don't even think Tommy had either cartoon on his channel, so I have no idea what you are talking about.

Anyhow, someone else here was once talking about getting their reuploads taken down, I've said this before:

despite the fact that the cartoons Tommy has released on disc are public domain, these are new proprietary restorations from his label, Cartoons On Film. These proprietary restorations all contain various manipulations/new additions of material which render them unique and distinctive from raw copies of the original films. The physical media packaging, program introduction, and end titles for each individual film all contain notices of this proprietary nature. I’m not sure why this is hard to understand, and why people feel entitled to upload them to Youtube instead of supporting him by keeping them off, especially when Tommy’s label has been dedicated to making films out of circulation or (gasp!) previously lost available in the best way possible

To put it bluntly, if Tommy is the source of the scan, he's done enough to it to warrant a takedown of the scan itself; since Garage sale scans aren't his, he wouldn't bother. Sounds like you are lying for some silly reason

There are a lot of skewed and inaccurate details in that comment. It sounds like we've got a somewhat misinformed/misguided/disgruntled Rockin' Lackey commenting here, especially considering the Farmer Alfalfa Youtube channel mention. Mods/admins, take note.

To date, I haven't posted copies of those particular films on my channel, nor kept track of anyone else doing so on their own channels.

The only videos I file takedown notices for are direct reuploads of things that I've posted on my channel, or rips of my restored releases which some folks grab from physical discs or from broadcast. If and when restored versions of those specific titles come out from my label, then I will file takedown notices for other rips/uploads of those versions.

I have plenty more to say about years worth of abusive behavior perpetrated by the person who is now masquerading around social media as some sort of official Farmer Alfalfa entity (LOL)—a.k.a. a major player in the 'Restored Fleischer Cartoons' motley crew—and the dude's ragtag colleagues. But I will bite my tongue for now.

Gonna say upfront that any users who deliberately post misleading information in order to paint another member in a negative light will be permanently banned.

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Thanks! Frankly I have no interest in discussing the topic here; this particular thread has had a lot of intellectual conversation about the Fables from some of the folks here and its been nice to keep it mostly that way. That said, I also will not tolerate any straight up lying, especially someone whose seemingly joined the forum just to do it

That said, if you guys want, I can share MILL POND as I have the Garage Sale transfer. Missing moral, though I may of seen it from another print with a VB Fable moral attached to it

There are a lot of skewed and inaccurate details in that comment. It sounds like we've got a somewhat misinformed/misguided/disgruntled Rockin' Lackey commenting here, especially considering the Farmer Alfalfa Youtube channel mention. Mods/admins, take note.

To date, I haven't posted copies of those particular films on my channel, nor kept track of anyone else doing so on their own channels.

The only videos I file takedown notices for are direct reuploads of things that I've posted on my channel, or rips of my restored releases which some folks grab from physical discs or from broadcast. If and when restored versions of those specific titles come out from my label, then I will file takedown notices for other rips/uploads of those versions.

Even if you didn't publish these two films on your YouTube channel, it would appear that you did broadcast these videos at private screenings, hence your interest in sending copyright infringement warnings to other channels. In fact, most of the Dinky Doodle films you reported were not even published on your channel.

I have plenty more to say about years worth of abusive behavior perpetrated by the person who is now masquerading around social media as some sort of official Farmer Alfalfa entity (LOL)—a.k.a. a major player in the 'Restored Fleischer Cartoons' motley crew—and the dude's ragtag colleagues. But I will bite my tongue for now.

The people from the Rockin Pins channel explained to me very well how you arranged to delete all their videos so that your channel could obtain a monopoly on the broadcasting of cartoons, so I understood perfectly well what your real objectives were.

However, I'm a good prince and I'm willing to listen to your explanations, even if I doubt you're telling the truth.

Thanks! Frankly I have no interest in discussing the topic here; this particular thread has had a lot of intellectual conversation about the Fables from some of the folks here and its been nice to keep it mostly that way. That said, I also will not tolerate any straight up lying, especially someone whose seemingly joined the forum just to do it

That said, if you guys want, I can share MILL POND as I have the Garage Sale transfer. Missing moral, though I may of seen it from another print with a VB Fable moral attached to it

Why do you pretend to ignore the other film when it is precisely this one that has been deleted?

Your altitude is suspicious, to say the least.

Jack Skellington, using accusatory choice phrases such as claiming Tommy Jose is "obtain[ing] a monopoly on the broadcasting of cartoons" will not be tolerated, and frankly sound like you are approaching this discussion in bad faith. Instead of providing evidence (screenshots, Wayback Machine archives) that backs up your statements, you've instead doubled down. This is not a professional way of addressing a concern with someone's behavior.

Your attitude is suspicious, to say the least. Hence, your account has been indefinitely banned.

Additionally, this thread is not the appropriate place to air grievances regarding other members. Please keep that content off the board.

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